Hannah Shuck was born 28 Nov 1756, possibly in New Jersey, daughter of Andrew Shuck (est1733-1803) and Margaret _____; died 17 Sep 1832 at Danville, Lincoln (now Boyle) County, Kentucky; buried Wilson Station Cemetery near Junction City, Lincoln (now Boyle) County, Kentucky; married 7 Apr 1790 at Lincoln Co., Kentucky, probably near Danville in modern Boyle County, to John (Jean) Baptiste.
This subject has been shown in the known records with a given name of John or Jean and surname for himself and descendants of Baptiste/Baptist, Batiste/Batist or misspelled/mistranscribed as Babtiste. I think that it is likely that, given common French naming customs, "Baptiste" was originally a middle name and that an original French "surname" was dropped. This "surname" may have been a family name, place name, etc. We have seen many individuals named "Jean-Baptiste Something-or-other", "Jean-Claude Something-or-other", etc. Sons are named Jean (John) and it is the middle name that distinguishes them (similar to German naming practice where all sons had a first name of Johann and it was the middle name that distinguished them). Jean-Baptiste would honor John the Baptist.
Consequently, I think it more likely that the correct, original spelling of the name of our subject should be "Baptiste" rather than the variations found: Batist, Batiste, Baliste, Batise (will of Andrew Shuck), Babtiste. This seems to be confirmed by general popularity in spelling by other individuals, as well as names of descendants subsequently found who predominantly spell "Baptiste". If one wishes to pursue his ancestors, a French Canadian origin may be possible. (But see notes, below.)
An interesting historical and parallel example is found in the naming of the son of Sacagawea, the Shoshoni Indian who accompanied Lewis and Clark on their expedition in search of the Northwest Passage. She was a wife of the French Canadian Touissant Charbonneau. Their son, who was born Feb. 11, 1805 at Fort Mandan was named "Jean Baptiste" whose full name was Jean Baptiste Charbonneau, but appears to be usually referred to in the records and literature as just "Jean Baptiste" or "Baptiste", apparently dropping the actual surname of "Charbonneau". I suspect the naming situation is similar with husband of Hannah Shuck. This is also why I am speculating that he may have been of French Canadian origin. (An interesting historical bio. see Jean Baptiste Charbonneau ). Also Jean-Baptiste (name) @ Wikipedia .
According to the following brief reference, Jean/John Batiste/Baptiste appeared in some records as "Jean Batiste St. Onge". From Kentucky Marriage Records, page 325 which gives his marriage record:
1790.
4- 7--Batiste, John, Hannah dau.
of Andres Shuch. [This man
is probably the same as Jean
Batiste St. Onge, who ap-
pears occasionally on the
county records].
Kentucky Marriage Records : From The Register Of The
Kentucky Historical Society; Baltimore; Genealogical Pub. Co., 1983;
viii, 1024 p. ; 23 cm ; ISBN/ISSN: 0806310421 ; Page 325.
However, I have not seen any of those "county records" which give St. Onge as a surname or even a citation to them.
If the above is correct, "St. Onge" may have been a "dit" name. In French, "dit" means "say" and in this context means "called." It is like a nickname or alias in the English and is distinct from an original family surname. For example, in another family branch, individuals have been found in early St. Louis County, Missouri, an historically French settlement, identified as Jean Baptiste Piant (Payant) dit. St. Onge (1805-1806), John Baptiste Piant (Payant) dit. St. Onge (1820-aft1880) and similar. This family was from Quebec. The source of the "dit" name could be an adoptive family name, a place where they were from, a place where they lived, a characteristic of the land where they lived (river/stream), etc.
Some good links on "dit" names:
A family history Salt of the Earth says (page 7) Jean Baptiste emigrated from "Lyons" (Lyon), France.
Another family history The Roots Grow Deep
An unknown family history "recently" published (ca. 2000) places Jean Baptiste in Lyon, France before coming to help fight in the American Revolution. I have no further information about that. (If he fought in the Revolution, there might be some patriot record but I have not found any. Further, that might indicate a birth year as early as 1750/60 (if he were 15-25) or before, which places him in the same age group (estimated) as Hannah Shuck.)
A family tree at FamilySearch.org apparently derived from an old Pedigree Resource File (PRF) submission (MMD8-SPS) shows a "Jean Baptiste" born 30 March 1759 at Varennes S/Teche, Allier, France. The source is cited as Naissances du département de l’Allier en France, 1560 à 1909 Ancestry.com The record at Ancestry.com shows the given name as "Jean" and "Baptiste" as the surname, not as a combination first and second name, which is probably how it got selected. The record names parents as Antoine Baptiste (given name, surname) and Jacqueline MacHure; First and Second Witness names: Jean Giruad and Claudine Baptiste. However, there is NO rationale expressed in that family tree connecting this March 1759 individual to our subject Jean Baptiste. Further, I see that this region is not noted for wine making and other than the name and proximity of the birth date, no connection is demonstrated with the subject Jean Batiste as well as previously reported origin in Lyon, France in the Rhône-Alpes region which is known for containing two of France's best wine-making regions near Lyon Beaujolais and Côtes du Rhône. Allier is in central France in the Auvergne region. A further search at Ancestry.com shows dozens of individuals named Jean Baptiste (middle, given names) Something-or-other (surname) who were born late 1750's, early 1760's. It is not possible for me to determine, though seemingly very unlikely, that coverage of all French birth records for this period is complete. I believe that the claim the March 1759 individual is our subject Jean Baptiste is unproven and probably incorrect.
Jean Baptiste apparently fought in the Revolutionary War, as a Soldier in the Virginia Continental Line, but unknown branch. I have not seen a direct service record but on 30 January 1784 he was awarded a warrant (Warrant ID 2322.0) as Babtiste, Jean for 200 acres for his service as a Soldier in the Virginia Continental Line (unknown branch). It is presumed this person is the subject here. Another warrant (Warrant ID 2663.0) was issued to Baptiste, Jean 1 March 1784 for 100 acres for his service as a Soldier in the Virginia Continental Line (unknown branch). Warrant 1463 8/1/1783 to a Warren, John 200 acres Virginia Continental Line. That land was sold to Claud Piat then to John Baptiste. Baptiste eventually had 300 acres surveyed on Drake's Creek. He reportedly grew grapes to make wine.
I have not examined any land records or attempted to trace the use of the above warrants or land ownership. There are open questions. Would Jean Baptiste have had to file and application? Did Jean Baptiste exercise the 1/30/1784 warrant? Did Jean Baptiste serve with John Warren? Is there more documentation?
Online sources for the warrants:
http://www.sos.state.ky.us/intranet/Revdetail.asp?Type=w&warrant=2322.0
Detailed Information About
Babtiste, Jean
Warrant ID 2322.0 Veteran Name Babtiste, Jean
Assignee Acres 200 Years Unknown
Rank Soldier Unit Virginia Continental Line
Branch Unknown Date 1/30/1784
Authorized No [identified] patents in Kentucky
Note
Another warrant:
http://www.sos.state.ky.us/intranet/Revdetail.asp?Type=w&warrant=2663.0
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Detailed Information About
2663.0
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Warrant ID 2663.0 Veteran Baptiste, Jean
Name
Assignee Acres 100 Years 3
Rank Soldier Unit Virginia
Continental Line
Branch Unknown Date 3/1/1784
Authorized OK 4484*
Note
Jean Baptiste is shown in Lincoln Co., Kentucky records: 1790 (tax list), 1800 (tax list) and 1820 (census). The 1820 census Lincoln Co. seems to be his last appearance in any records.
The following passage comes from a family history called The East Bend McConnells written in 1964 by Anna McConnell Vanness Huston (1889-1980) and Elizabeth Espy (1882-1977), granddaughters of Mary Stuart McConnell (1823-1902) (below) who were old enough to know their grandmother and would have had a closer access to the family history. It is reportedly generally accurate with respect to facts and relationships when evaluated against primary sources now readily available online.
In this westward trek was a sprinkling of Frenchmen, for the most part soldiers who had come to America with Lafayette. The war over, these men needing more worlds to conquer, what better could serve them than the wilds of the west with the promise of adventure and l possible wealth in the rich new lands? Other of their countrymen hearing of the vast, new territory, followed them. Of these later arriving Frenchmen, was one Jean Baptiste in search for land suitable for grape growing, such as he had lived in in the wine producing section of his native France. But more of him later.
Another group turning their faces to the west were natives of Germany who had first migrated to Holland, then denied the religious freedom they had sought, had come to America. To them too the further migration to the west beckoned, promising greater prosperity, as well as more freedom. In this group was the Shuck family (originally spelled Schuch,) who eventually settled near Danville, Kentucky.
Still another group were the McConnells of Scotch-Irish extraction and living in Pennsylvania. There is little doubt that gay and volitile qualities of the Irish mixed with the sober, substantial traits of the Scotch, were responsible for the fact that this company joined the migrants to the west. There was adventure ahead, and the possibility of material wealth, facts not unattractive to this mixed strain. It is not unlikely that these men, (possibly somewhat arrogant) did not get on too well with the milder Quakers of Pennsylvania. Anyway whatever the cause, such a considerable number of this name migrated to Kentucky that at one time there was a "McConnell Station" in the state, perhaps a namesake of the still existent town "McConnellsburg" in Southern Pennsylvania.
Jean Baptiste as previously mentioned searching for grape growing land and climate, finally located it in central Kentucky along what later became and is now Perryville Road, and settled a few miles from Danville in Boyle County. Once established, as was to be expected, Mr. Baptiste looked around for a wife and in 1790 married Hannah Shuck. To this union were born three daughters, Elizabeth, Margret and Sarah. Of these Margret interests us primarily. At sometime shortly before the war of 1812 she was married to a John Ford, and became the mother of John B. Ford famous as the first manufacturer of plate glass in America, and later becoming a very rich and influential man. The father Ford's part in the welfare of the family was brief, for during the war he joined a group of Kentucky volunteers, went south and died either from exposure, or was killed in the Battle of New Orleans. At any rate he was heard from no more, and after a few years Margret married one John Stuart. To this union was born near Danville on May 3, 1823 a girl baby named Mary. From here on the record is cloudy. Little is known about Stuart, either of his forebears or of his conduct after marriage. Whether because of illness or of shiftlessness, it seems likely that he was a poor provider for his family, and his wife probably because of poverty allowed little Mary when 6 or 7 years old to be legally adopted by Benjamin Cruthfield, a prosperous but childless neighbor.
We do not have any further information about John Baptiste, particularly any records that might prove birth or death dates. He was last seen in the 1820 census at Lincoln Co., Kentucky and presumably died 1820/1830. A death date of 1825 is solely anecdotal from the above passage from The Roots Grow Deep.
Jean Baptiste is presumed buried next to his wife Hannah at Wilson Station Cemetery. Hannah died 1832 so if John died about 1825 there were only 7 years separating their deaths. Transcription of tombstones at that cemetery shows burials before 1825 (I think earliest was 1821.)
I have not done any original or systematic search of the records, just picked up information from published sources. Specifically, I have not attempted to search land or probate for Jean Baptiste. I have not researched Floyd County, Indiana where some of the descendants migrated. As of April 2014, none of the Floyd County descendants' graves are included in Findagrave.com; I suspect some are buried in the same cemetery with at least some having existant markers. I have not attempted to determine if there were any Floyd County newspapers (Greenville or New Albany) of the period 1825 to 1850/1860. Since John Baptiste Ford (1811-1903) was a prominent local merchant, I would presume there would be articles about him along with news about the deaths of five of his infant/young children there between 1832 and 1850.
The children are uncertain. I have seen no proof or primary sources, only claims from a variety of downstream narratives and legends. I am going into more detail on them here because of all the uncertainties. Those whose names frequently appear as children are:
Little is known of Jonathan [Ford], except that he was from Virginia and believed to have been of English Descent. Despite this, he seems to have borne a hatred for the British, inasmuch as he left his family to enlist in a Kentucky Volunteer Homespun regiment that marched away late in 1813 to fight the British in New Orleans. [War of 1812.] Mrs. Ford was only 22 at this time, carrying her fourth child. Jonathan was never heard of again, so young John [John Baptiste Ford (1811-1903) couldn't even remember his father.More from "The Roots Grow Deep":
[Ford] states she did marry Jonathan Ford when she was 15. [This is consistent with reported birth date of 1791 and marriage in 1807. Described as Jean Baptiste's youngest daughter.]A family tree at FamilySearch.org apparently derived from an old Pedigree Resource File (PRF) submission (MMD8-SPS) shows the father of Jonathan Ford as a Joseph Ford (1751-1812). ("Pedigree Resource File," database, FamilySearch (http://familysearch.org/pal:/MM9.2.1/3SR6-CVX : accessed 2014-05-07), entry for John Baptiste /Ford/) Could the 1812 death be significant re: War of 1812 and Jonathan's hatred of the Brits? There is no source citation for this claim.
Page 2: John Ford's mother, Margaret, who had come from Danville about 1837 to Greenville, died in August of 1840. Ford had lost ... his mother, who had died at 48.
Margaret reportedly married second some years later (est 1820-1822) to a John Stuart and had one child by him. Nothing further on this John Stuart.
Four children (Ford):
Two children (Stuart):
AFN: 23P3-CWB
Also appeared to stay put in Lincoln Co. KY. Nothing on him after 1820.
Kentucky Marriages Early to 1800; Liahona Research.
AF online indicates his birth place may have been New Jersey. Would have been Estimated 1750. That seems a remote possibility, but still plausible; Mathias Shuck, brother of Hannah Shuck Baptiste, in his pension application claimed he was born in New Jersey (1759).
A LOT of 'Batiste' in Louisiana.
Possibility of family linkage (?): A Jean Baptiste GAREAU ST. ONGE AFN: 14CT-MTB b/c 5 May 1717 Boucherville, Chambly, Quebec,Canada s/o Jean Baptiste GAREAU.
AWT file h4860a indicates he and Hannah Shuck were parents of Elizabeth Batiste. It appears he was the father, but unlikely that Hannah Shuck was the mother. See notes for Elizabeth.
Revisions:
04 May 2014
06 May 2014